What’s the Most Effective Dog Training Method?
it is an awesome day in the bluegrass it
rained earlier and so it’s a lot cooler
than it was yesterday it got up to about
96 degrees yesterday and when it gets
real hot like I’ve told you before the
dogs lay out quick and so you have to
change around your day and it can be
kind of weird but like on a day like
today where it rains early in the States
just a little bit overcast you can get
some high-level dog training in even in
mid-july alright so now what we’re going
to talk about today is a question of
efficacy versus effectiveness but just
real quick I’ll talk about effectiveness
right hey George come over here for a
second now this is my son George and
you’ll notice George has some notes in
his hand he also is wearing a shirt it’s
a wrestling shirt so when kids get to
about Georges age sheets 11 gonna be 12
then they start thinking about things
like wrestling and girls and video games
and they don’t think they’re old man is
so cool or know so much right so even
though my son has about the most awesome
job in the world he thinks that that job
is not that much fun in relation to
playing what is it fortnight that you
play fortnight and wrestling and chasing
girls okay
so for the next couple of years of
George’s life whenever I’m making the
video he has to carry around notes for
the video and whenever I ask him where
we’re at on the notes if he doesn’t know
that he loses access to those things
that he likes so you can go back over
there behind there
so you see guys I don’t just like preach
these principles I live these principles
around around this compound the
dentist’s compound right if you want
access to stuff you got to do the work
right we don’t there’s no free rides
here it’s ain’t about Obama land here
right this is all for work anything you
want you’re going to work for it and
when I say work I want a little bit
better work than yesterday and that’s
what we’re talking about today is just
getting a little bit better work than
yesterday because what pops up in dog
training over and over and over again
are questions of efficacy versus
effectiveness all right now you might
say well Stoney what what does that mean
I’m not sure I thought those words were
kind of the same thing well in
conversational
you know situations they are kind of the
same and you’ll hear me talk about
things like efficacy rates over time or
effectiveness rates over time and so if
you’re just talking to somebody yeah
that’s fine but like if you’re a
scientist and I do consider my signs
myself a scientist you know I may be a
hillbilly scientist but I’m still a
scientist I’m out here trying to get
closer and closer to dog training truth
you know trying to get closer and closer
to the the most efficient way to
communicate information to people and
dogs right so every day I’m trying to
prove my game I mean I’m coming out here
trying to be on point every single day
and there’s a common criticism that’s
levied against dog trainers that do the
kind of stuff that I do right and we’ll
walk up here so I can show you as I talk
but and that’s that positive
reinforcement training right is it has a
high degree of efficacy but a low degree
of effectiveness okay and so what is
efficacy efficacy is how well something
works in a controlled situation right so
when scientists are doing studies it’s
very controlled and so they’ll have an
efficacy rate but unfortunately high
efficacy rates do not always translate
into high effectiveness rates efficacy
rates being how well something performs
in a controlled situation effectiveness
being how well something you know
produces a desired result in an
uncontrolled situation so kind of like
controlled versus what people will call
real life right and I get that criticism
on my video sometimes I just got it the
other day and which I shouldn’t even
listen because YouTube is full of fake
experts I mean even the people that are
experts on YouTube are usually fake but
the commenters are all fake you know and
so somebody was like hey stony you know
what you’re doing with the treat work
and what-have-you that would never work
in real life I’m like dude what are you
talking about this is my real life
showing me LaShawn what my real life is
right this is my life every day 365 days
a year seven days a week
morning and night you know I’m out here
training dogs me I’m out here eli’s out
here five days a week my son George is
out here seven days a week my son
Nicholas
is going off to military academy he when
he was young he was out here seven days
a week so we live this this is real life
if you live a life with dogs that’s more
chaotic than mine that has more coming
and going a more activity than mine
then listen well more power to you I
mean if you have a more crazy life than
I do
well you must live in a warzone and so
you know dog training is probably the
least thing your even should be thinking
about but anyway back to the criticism
you know people say hello Stoney that
won’t work in a you know those food work
techniques are that positive
reinforcement training that’s not real
life that won’t work in the real world
you know all right well look I’ll give
you that I’ll give you a it’s a fair
that’s a fair thing to say that the
positive reinforcement training doesn’t
work in the real world okay but guess
what neither does any of the other stuff
right so if you’re doing leash and
collar work or you’re doing electric
collar work most of the time it doesn’t
work either none of it works 100% of the
time all you’re dealing with when you’re
talking about dog training is reducing
the incidence rate of failure so nothing
is a hundred percent effective a hundred
percent of the time so if you’re gonna
make that criticism about positive
reinforcement training then you should
you know make that criticism about all
kinds of dog training you know none of
us are perfect dog trainers none of the
dogs are perfect so nothing works 100%
of the time but if you think for one
second that positive reinforcement
training can’t be both efficacious and
effective well then you just haven’t
been watching my channel you haven’t
watched it not just me I mean there’s a
lot of people that do this kind of work
all over the country and so when you see
people and yes I’m not gonna lie like if
you’re in a control situation with your
dog and you’ve got you a treat and
you’re holding a treat up over its head
right now it’s going to sit I’ve never
seen a dog that wouldn’t sit in the
kitchen by the cookie jar right now
that’s an efficacious technique take a
treat by your refrigerator pull it up
over your head and dog will sit so in
your kitchen that that technique is a
100 percent efficacious now as soon as
aunt sally comes to the door right it
doesn’t work anymore so it’s not
effective right does that mean that food
work with the dog is not an effective
part of an overall strategy no it just
means that the person employing those
techniques doesn’t fully understand the
methodology all right
and that’s the same thing with leash and
collar work I mean like leash and collar
work happens in a controlled situation
you go out in the yard you put a leash
and collar on your dog and you
manipulate the dog into minding like you
want to you know all pressure based
systems and that would be like you know
electric collar work or leash and collar
work where you put pressure on a dog the
dog relieves the pressure by engaging in
the specified behavior right all of it
every bit of it
it’s a controlled environment right you
had to put your leash and collar on your
dog you had to put the electric collar
on the dog whatever right and so like it
works in a controlled environment so it
is efficacious and it works if done
properly in a real-world environment so
it’s effective and so what I’m saying is
positive reinforcement training is
efficacious right it works in a
controlled environment and if not done
properly it does not work in the real
world but I’m saying that’s the same
thing with leash and collar work
electric collar work or any of the
so-called pressure based systems
positive reinforcement training can be
efficacious and work in a controlled
environment and also effective right as
can leash and collar work and and an
electric collar work if the the
methodology is employed correctly right
and in the right kind of environment so
that’s what we’re going to talk about
right now you know why do I choose this
kind of training you know and not the
pressure based training I grew up doing
the pressure based training you know and
to be honest with you like I’m good at
it I’m as good at it as what a person
can be and sometimes I teach it like
I’ll have old fella come out here and
he’s like I don’t I just like doing it
the way I I always did it can you just
show me my me you know
polish up my rough edges yes sure yeah
I’ll teach you you know but if you come
out here and you ask me say don’t how do
you like to do it well obviously if you
watch my video channel you see how I
like to do it because it’s fun guys and
and the one thing I can tell you the
hundred-percent truth right is the most
effective dog training is the dog
training that ultimately gets employed
in the home environment right it you can
give people a great a great system if
they’re not going to do at home it’s not
going to work right so when you want to
make that move from efficaciousness you
know working in controlled environment
like when you’re dog trainer sitting
there watching you to effectiveness it
has to be something that the dog owner
is going to do and it needs to be
something that
the dog enjoys doing right if the dog
owner enjoys doing the techniques and
the dog enjoys doing the techniques then
you’re going to get more repetitions and
ultimately more repetitions lead to
habit and habit is by far the most
important thing in dog training habit is
the strongest motivator of all
motivators and let me let me show you
what I mean here okay so I’m gonna call
slow dog miss Shelby and she ran over
here and put her head in that leash and
I give her a treat okay now so she put
her head in that leash for what’s called
extrinsic or external motivation like
she put her head in the leash then
something happened now what was that
something that happened that’s something
that happened was I gave her a piece of
food right now did she do it simply for
the piece of food no that’s the first
thing that people misunderstand about
positive reinforcement dog training the
dog didn’t come over here and stick her
head in the leash just because I gave
her a piece of food that food is
representative of my approval it
provides information that she’s doing
the right thing there’s an element of
competitiveness and and gamesmanship to
this right because she is competing with
these other dogs like if she gets my
attention if she gets my approval she’s
getting it to the exclusion of the other
dogs right so see I’m spending special
time with her you’ll notice that I have
a pretty big place and like when you go
to look at most kennels you’ll see the
however big their property is they try
to fill that up with building so they
can house a lot of dogs I don’t do it
that way I’m kind of more like a chef
and like a chef you know like a chef
opens a restaurant because he wants
people to come eat his food not because
he wants to make a lot of money and if
you want to make a lot of money in the
restaurant business you get a McDonald’s
right I mean that’s how you make a lot
of money high volume low price chefs
they have to charge a little bit more
but they provide a better service and a
higher quality product right but really
what they’re feeding is they’re feeding
their own desire to do something
properly and that’s the same thing I do
guys I got a lot of green space in
relation to how much building I have and
that’s very important for me now I’d
like to have so much
greenspace because what it allows me to
do is it allows me to put the dogs in a
situation where freedom is not something
that they have to you know that they
have to worry about getting they’re
gonna get plenty of freedom right I come
out they can run around and play with
the other dogs what these dogs want it’s
not just the freedom to go play but they
want the freedom to be able to attract
my attention look at this little dog
she’s trying to attract my attention by
coming over here and working with me and
then this treat is just simply a
physical manifestation of my attention
and pleasure that’s it that’s all to
this so I’ll come out and I start to
educate the dogs as to what’s expected
real simple
right and I make it a fun game so if you
think about positive reinforcement
training the way you should think about
it like it’s not about a dog doing
something for food it’s kind of like a
dog playing a game we’re winning the
game results in more access in a general
sense right so in the beginning stages
the dogs playing the game and like it
gets the treat so it just got a point
kinda right and that represent my
attention and approval but pretty soon
the dog will start to generalize that
pattern says oh if I do something I get
a piece of food well what if I wanted
something else what if I wanted to be
petted what if I wanted to go in the
building or out of the building what if
I wanted my cheeto if I wanted to play
fetch
is there a behavior that I could plug
into this situation that would lead to
me getting to do what I want to do so
so yes positive reinforcement starts
with very specific external rewards you
said I’m saying they see this puppy just
hopped up here and started like jumping
along here look and I say hey I
appreciate that puppy did that for
external motivation right to get this
treat and that’ll happen for a long time
the pup you’ll go from this pattern of
very specific access like it wants
access to this to my attention in this
piece of food to general access where
the puppy understands that behavior
leads to whatever it wants okay to a
kind of a state where the dog just says
well listen I just get up and do things
that way because kinda that’s the way
I’ve always done them you know and
you’re the same way you like the same
toothpaste you wear the same kind of
underwear you drive the same route to
work you drink the same kind of coffee
right
guys habit is what’s important and all
it takes to get to have it to successful
repetitions that’s why it doesn’t really
matter whether you get the repetitions
using positive reinforcement you know or
some other like compulsive or pressure
based system like as long as you get to
the point long as you are persistent and
consistent you will get to the point
where you’ve established habit and habit
of self reinforcing okay but from my
perspective this is just a fun way to
train and so this is why I like to train
and you’ll see how you know I’m giving
this dog quite a few treats look at this
dog he’s been here a little longer and
you know look I’m not hardly having any
of him any treats at all so let’s call
somebody else that’s new
hey goose all right so here comes goose
and look how goose ran right over here
he had a stick you know and he was
playing with a stick and I called him
and when I called him you know he didn’t
hear hey goose you have to leave your
stick and come here because tony has
something that you have to do what he
heard in his mind was oh wow Stoney’s
willing to pay attention to me I should
have run over there as quick as possible
and get some of that good attention I
just find that a fun way to train come
on goose now I’m still in the phase with
this young dog of having to provide
physical manifestations of my pleasure
or what’s called extrinsic or external
motivation and so that’s why you’ll see
me give him some treats every so often
but guys he’s 16 weeks old and I mean
look if I have to give him some treats
is that really such a high price to pay
if I was up if I was doing traditional
training I would have to give him some
Corrections if I was doing any kind of
pressure based systems you know at 16
week old he’s not gonna be a hundred
percent reliable so ultimately weight
the decision is you know I’m stuck at a
stage the dog cannot have a
well-established pattern of behavior
habitual behavior at sixteen weeks so
I’m gonna have to do some type of
external motivation right so is am I
gonna do something that’s positive at
the dogs working for or am I gonna do
something negative that the dogs working
to avoid I you know they both work but
man I’m telling you I think that
positive reinforcement has a lot of
collateral benefits that pressure based
systems just don’t have
I mean see how willingly this dog and
look look this dogs not on a leash no
she just came right along behind said
hey can I work too so these are the
collateral benefits of doing a style of
training where the dog can control the
dog can exert a certain amount of
autonomy over its environment I’m not
really bossing these dogs on what to do
I’m saying hey I would like Sun to do
some things with you and they say okay
well Stoney whenever you do stuff with
us it works out to our advantage and so
they go okay well let’s do it now just
like any game guys there’s rules to
games it doesn’t matter basketball
football baseball there’s rules right
and so you have to follow those rules so
when you’re doing positive reinforcement
training know it’s not always positive
it’s not always positive okay sometimes
you know you just are gonna have to do
things that your puppy just doesn’t like
but we try to reduce that we try to make
it so that that doesn’t happen very
often we come out and we educate our
puppies as to what’s expected and then
we use external or extrinsic motivation
to give them a reason to do what’s
expected and then we just keep repeating
that in ever-increasing levels of
environmental distraction until the
behavior is reliable it’s such a simple
process and it works so well
unfortunately yes there are a lot of
people out there doing positive
reinforcement training that think that
the training is about food the food is
nothing guys the food is a very small
part of the overall training process
what we’re trying to do is make the dog
understand the relationship between
indirect action and access to what it
wants in other words make it understand
that if it’ll come and be still and have
good manners it’s gonna get lots of
great stuff
what’s up Shelby so let’s go over here
I’ll show you I got a good idea that we
came up with last night to show you what
I mean about how effective like positive
reinforcement training can be and how
you get from the point of efficacy or or
the desired results in a controlled
situation to not controlled situation
all right so come on gonna come over
here and I have me two lion tamer stands
okay so what I call them you know why
call them lion-tamer stands because when
you go to the circus right you see them
put them lines and tigers up on them
stands well so I got me some little lion
tamer stands here alright so I’m gonna
take two puppies both of them are about
16 weeks old and I’m gonna give them an
opportunity to sit and stay on these
lion tamers stands so you stay there hey
Shelby Shelby Shelby
come on Shelby Shelby tell me now
Shelby’s over there eating
I think I spilled some treats hey come
on ‘red good alright so I teach these
puppies goose now this is also a name
recognition drill guys so you’ll see
sometimes if I try to call one of the
dogs that the other dog comes and that’s
perfectly that’s perfectly normal
right when you’re working towards
reliability remember what you’re doing
is you’re reducing your incidence rate
of failure you don’t go from from not
doing it to doing it perfectly like
overnight
it’s it’s not doing it to doing it
sometimes to doing it more times to
doing it most of the times they’re doing
it almost all the time right
remember what I told you no dog training
system is a hundred percent effective a
hundred percent of the time because
people aren’t a hundred percent you know
consistent or persistent and the dogs
you know they got their they got things
they want to do so I put these dogs up
on these lion tamer stands and I start
just you know saying okay here’s the
rules of the game this element of the
game you’re going to stay there and
you’re gonna compete with these other
dogs and if you do a good job of playing
by the rules every so often you’re going
to get you a point you’re going to get a
reward okay now every day what I do is I
add time in between Oh every day what I
do is I add time in between the rewards
now see and you’ll lose them every so
often right it’s okay it’s okay
you know there’s no reason to fuss here
this is where like traditional trainers
right our traditional training
methodology would have you start fussing
when Shelby gets off of that lion tamer
stand it comes over here or goose gets
off and goes over there it’s not because
there
going hey I wonder if I can make
Stoney’s training session go poorly
that’s not what they’re doing what
they’re doing is they’re trying to
understand how to play this game of
earning access and so like if I make a
little noise or move towards this thing
from Shelby’s point of view if I’m Way
over here like hey this is where all the
attention is this is where all the
treats are so this is where I should go
and what I’m trying to convince them
okay it’s just a wait figure out what’s
Tony wants so I’m educating them as to
what I want to get them on the lion
tamer stand
okay then I’m motivating I’m giving them
a reason to stay on the lion tamer stand
I’m saying while you’re up there look
some good things are going to happen all
kinds of good things are going to happen
really but most of it is represented by
this food work right here so that’s a
physical manifestation of my pleasure
now every day as they start to master
the game I add time and distance and
distraction because like a game is no
fun if it’s too easy to win now look at
brick he went over there and peed on
that dog’s lion tamers stand and this
dog stayed do you see what I’m saying
so like there’s no doubt if I was in my
building and I had the lion tamer stand
out this would be an efficacious
technique the dog would stay because
like he didn’t have anything else to do
it’s just in the building so I bring
them out here and I practice in a
chaotic environment like you know it’s
hard to stay with somebody peeing on you
but look what goose did he stayed now so
every day I’m going to add time and
distance so distance away from the dog
time in between my treats okay and then
what I’m gonna add is levels of
distraction okay so like today what
we’re going to work on is getting them
to stay with the motorcycle on
so I put my motorcycle and she’ll be she
just she messed up okay
she didn’t mess up because she wanted to
mess up my video she’s just like why
wonder what’s Tony’s doing I’m gonna go
see well what I did is I moved back over
here and I said this is what what you
need to see is what the game we’re
playing you need to stay on the line
tame Burstein so I’ve added in that
level of distraction giving the retreats
and in every day I add in time distance
and distraction now I’ve got two dogs
out here and the reason I have two dogs
out here because I want to illustrate to
you that the same technique requires a
different amount of time to make it into
real-world effectiveness so Shelby is
very good at movement exercises she is
not as good at the stay exercises movers
in the dog world aren’t as good at
staying and stairs generally aren’t as
good at moving okay so you always have
to set your standards on a subjective
level like so for Shelby my
reinforcement schedule has to be a
little bit faster for her then it has to
be for goose but see how I’m moving away
and that was too far for Shelby that was
too far okay but look at goose he did
fine so Shelby has to get back up on the
stand right I’m gonna walk my goose and
I’m say hey I appreciate it now I’m
gonna try to walk around here know and
look what I just got
I just got quite a bit of time quite a
bit of distance stay and quite a bit of
distraction wait there it’s very
important that when I’m communicating to
the dogs I’m communicating in a way that
makes sense to them stay Oh so dog gets
up and I don’t fuss I don’t carry on I
mean goose doesn’t want to mess up he
just messes up sometimes stay there
Shelby get over here wait there good
stay go back to adding time distance and
distraction
good today and then like any anything in
the world the best time is when like
you’ve accomplished your goal so our
goal was to get them to set up there and
now I’m gonna let them go and make over
them okay babies baby baby coos oh you
good baby oh my god you’re such a good
dog oh don’t a good dog all right so you
know so that’s what we’re doing every
day we come out here and we educate the
dog Castille what’s expected then we
explained to him why doing what’s
expected is gonna work out to their
benefit in the long run then we
gradually add time and distance and
distraction and and you know we make the
game harder because I’m telling you it’s
a little hard like for me to completely
make you understand without you doing it
a lot but like when you make your
training challenging right the dog will
start to like like you yearn for those
opportunities to prove itself against
those challenges it’s just like anybody
that works out or plays a sport or
climbs a mountain or whatever you know
those things like are intrinsically
rewarding so yes you start out treat
treat petting and praise whatever but
over the course of time guys all you
have to do is get successful repetitions
right and once the dog starts to
internalize accomplishment of a given
task then habit takes over and you will
have a reliable dog and Weis a reliable
not a hundred percent but it’s close to
a hundred percent as what you can get
and I don’t care again I don’t care what
methods you used you want to be a
pressures trainer
go ahead I’ve seen a million good ones
I’ve seen a million good dogs of
pressure training right I just like to
do it this way so like the next time
this is just for people that comment on
my videos the next time you go to
thinking about saying that like this
kind of training is not effective in the
real world because I know if you comment
on my videos you probably comment on
other people’s videos look just take a
minute pull your hands away from that
keyboard right and ask yourself do you
really understand what you’re saying
or are you just saying something because
you were posting from a position of
basic ignorance you just don’t
understand the methodology my opinion is
you’re posting from a position of
ignorance okay and it’s bad etiquette
you know I don’t mind if anybody gets on
here and ask me questions if they say
hey stony would that be effective in the
real world or what about this situation
what about in a boat what about on the
ocean what about on the moon whatever
okay you asked me a question
but guys you know if you don’t have a
channel full of content you know and you
haven’t done all these different
methodologies then it’s just very poor
etiquette to get on people’s channels
and say that what they’re doing doesn’t
work obviously what they’re doing works
or they would be doing something else
now I have my own reasons for doing my
training the way that I do I have my own
reasons for making the sacrifices that I
make small building lots of green space
okay because that’s the way I like to do
it is it the only way no but it is most
certainly and demonstrable a 100%
effective way to be the best dog trainer
that a person can be all right now I’m
gonna show you a little bit more about
what I mean about how effective and
efficacious technique can be okay guys
let’s see if these techniques are both
efficacious and effective so we have my
adolescent distracted wrestling girls
and fortnight boy over here in charge of
footing the dogs on the lion tamer
stands while uncle Stoney or dad Stoney
said this guy back here gets on a
motorcycle and puts ultimate level of
distraction in the environment all right
Georgie now remember my son’s 11 years
old
and so like look besides the fact that
he’s uh you know fumbling with his
leashes you know he’s gonna get these
dogs up here and we’re gonna see if an
11 year old boy can get a dog to stay
you know as if these dogs will pay
attention to an 11 year old dog oh boy
now of course this is what happens guys
when you have boys is
this is how they arranged things like
y’all want to look at bricks behind you
know hey brick come here yeah they just
see this is why when your dogs hit that
adolescent stage or your children hit
that adolescent stage you have to
increase your level of oversight because
they’ll just put things backwards or
they’ll forget or whatever so don’t get
mad at them you know just give them some
notes make them carry those notes around
with them until they get things right so
here we go try not to run over any dolls
and they say positive reinforcement
doesn’t work and sometimes that’s the
truth but not always and on my chain
up my pattern
because the haters gonna say that the
dogs are not paying attention but I can
do it any direction that I want because
I’ve been practicing a whole lot every
day reliability comes from incremental
improvements so if you do things right
this dial of train
is also so be careful what you post
because you’ll look really silly when
you try to act like what I do does not
work because I’ll prove it every time
then I’ll ask you to do the same so I
guess the bottom line is that
if you’re gonna criticize uncle Stoney
then you need to put up some content and
prove that you can do it better
all right you’re not trained your dogs
have a good time
